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Thread: Questions for CJ

  1. #541
    Paperback Writer RevForum Administrator Amoeba's Avatar
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    Default Re: Questions for CJ

    Some good covers of it:

    To be, or not to be, that is the question: Whether 'tis nobler in the mind to suffer,
    Or to take arms against a sea of troubles, And by opposing end them.

  2. #542
    Administrator RevForum Administrator CornetJoyce's Avatar
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    Default Re: Questions for CJ

    Quote Originally Posted by Amoeba View Post

    You'll probably like this song if you don't already know it:
    I heard Mercedes do it several times. She was a Movement icon and rightly so.

    Quote Originally Posted by Amoeba View Post
    All that I ask of God
    is that I will not be indifferent to suffering,
    that I will not come to the moment of my death
    having failed to do what I could.
    reminds me of

    No time to give to those in need
    At last it was time to die
    And when before the Lord I came
    I stood with down cast eyes
    Within his hands he held a book
    It was “the book of life”
    God looked into his book and said
    Your name I cannot find
    I once was going to write it down
    But never found the time

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=loY0GJRPzUQ
    Einstein on marxology:
    "In the realm of the seekers after truth there is no human authority.
    Whoever attempts to play the magistrate there founders on the laughter of the Gods."

  3. #543
    Paperback Writer RevForum Administrator Amoeba's Avatar
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    Default Re: Questions for CJ

    Ochs expressed similar sentiments in When I'm Gone:

    To be, or not to be, that is the question: Whether 'tis nobler in the mind to suffer,
    Or to take arms against a sea of troubles, And by opposing end them.

  4. #544
    Paperback Writer RevForum Administrator Amoeba's Avatar
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    Default Re: Questions for CJ

    Quote Originally Posted by CornetJoyce View Post
    reminds me of

    No time to give to those in need
    At last it was time to die
    And when before the Lord I came
    I stood with down cast eyes
    Within his hands he held a book
    It was “the book of life”
    God looked into his book and said
    Your name I cannot find
    I once was going to write it down
    But never found the time
    By the way this is a common trope in the Bible, putting the onus away from God to the individual actor. It's like with St. Thomas and the Resurrection, where he doesn't believe the other Apostles that Jesus has come back, so he asks for empirical proof (via the senses). Jesus then shows up again, and, depending on what kind of Christian you are, either through sense of sight alone (most protestants) or sight and touch (most Catholics), Thomas expressed belief once more, to which Jesus said: "while it is good that you believe again now that I have shown myself/you have touched my wound, it would have been better if you believed without empirical evidence."

    It's a powerful argument and trope, because there's an intuitively attractive logic behind it. Don't we value things related to certain kinds of belief more when there is no physical evidence involved, like say our love and devotion for someone? How about for our parents? How about for our father? And there you get Feuerbach's Essence of Christianity argument that what you see playing out here is just a idealised anthropology, where human practices are reified in abstractions that we call religion when they form broader narratives.
    To be, or not to be, that is the question: Whether 'tis nobler in the mind to suffer,
    Or to take arms against a sea of troubles, And by opposing end them.

  5. #545
    Administrator RevForum Administrator CornetJoyce's Avatar
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    Default Re: Questions for CJ

    Jesus said, "I shall give you what no eye has seen and what no ear has heard and what no hand has touched and what has never occurred to the human mind."
    Einstein on marxology:
    "In the realm of the seekers after truth there is no human authority.
    Whoever attempts to play the magistrate there founders on the laughter of the Gods."

  6. #546
    Paperback Writer RevForum Administrator Amoeba's Avatar
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    Default Re: Questions for CJ

    Thomas the Doubter is probably my favorite Apostle. Paul comes a close second.
    To be, or not to be, that is the question: Whether 'tis nobler in the mind to suffer,
    Or to take arms against a sea of troubles, And by opposing end them.

  7. #547
    Administrator RevForum Administrator CornetJoyce's Avatar
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    Default Re: Questions for CJ

    Quote Originally Posted by Amoeba View Post
    Thomas the Doubter is probably my favorite Apostle. Paul comes a close second.
    I suppose Judas Iscariot is my favorite apostle, or to be more exact, the Judas in the Gospel of Kazantzakis. The Gospel of Thomas is one of my favorite Christian gospels, but of course it's beyond the bounds of the Church. Perhaps my favorite is the Gospel of Philip, in which the male apostles complain that Jesus loves Mary Magdalen more than them, and grumble about him kissing her.
    Einstein on marxology:
    "In the realm of the seekers after truth there is no human authority.
    Whoever attempts to play the magistrate there founders on the laughter of the Gods."

  8. #548
    Paperback Writer RevForum Administrator Amoeba's Avatar
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    Default Re: Questions for CJ

    I should read those.

    What about the Church Fathers? Augustine is my favorite. Among more recent Christian sects, Jesuits and the broader Liberation Theology movement are pretty great.

    Hélder Câmara

    "An advocate of liberation theology, he is remembered for his social and political work for the poor and for Human Rights and democracy during the military regime. Câmara preached for a church closer to the disfavoured people and for non-violence, despite not being totally opposed to violent tactics. He is quoted as having said, "When I give food to the poor, they call me a saint. When I ask why they are poor, they call me a communist."

    Câmara had some controversial views, endorsing the position of the Orthodox church that spouses who were abandoned should be allowed to remarry within the Church. He criticized Pope Paul VI's removal of artificial contraception from the purview of Vatican II as "a mistake" meant to "torture spouses, to disturb peace of many homes", "a new condemnation of Galileo", "the death of the Council" and "the practical denial of collegiality". However, by Humanae Vitae, he had changed his mind about contraception, being the first person to telegram the Vatican's Secretariat of State praising the controversial encyclical.

    In his famous interview with Italian journalist Oriana Fallaci, he also stated that, despite his support for non-violence, he didn't oppose violent tactics: "And I respect a lot priests with rifles on their shoulders; I never said that to use weapons against an oppressor is immoral or anti-Christian. But that's not my choice, not my road, not my way to apply the Gospels".

    Câmara identified himself as a socialist and not as a Marxist, and while disagreeing with Marxism, had marxist sympathies. In the Oriana Fallaci interview he stated, "My socialism is special, its a socialism that respects the human person and goes back to the Gospels. My socialism it is justice." He said, concerning Marx, that while he disagreed with his conclusions, he agreed with his analysis of the capitalist society."

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/H%C3%A9lder_C%C3%A2mara
    To be, or not to be, that is the question: Whether 'tis nobler in the mind to suffer,
    Or to take arms against a sea of troubles, And by opposing end them.

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