Page 18 of 26 FirstFirst ... 81617181920 ... LastLast
Results 341 to 360 of 501

Thread: Questions for CJ

  1. #341
    Administrator RevForum Administrator CornetJoyce's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    3,863

    Default Re: Questions for CJ

    Quote Originally Posted by Amoeba View Post
    I recently read something about how top Democrats were sabotaging McGovern even before he won the nomination, and continued afterward all throughout the campaign. That, also, is a commonality with the Corbyn phenomenon.
    And not only DP politicians. The AFL was pro-war and threatened peacenik liberals with retribution, thus aiding the GOP in ending liberalism and its attendant union influence. British unions may be less suicidal than that.

    The wiki misses a few points for what it's worth. Nixon was the incumbent and had not been disgraced yet. He had promised to end the war "with honor" i.e: through "Vietnamization"- a delusion shared by J Kennedy, Johnson, Humphrey, R Kennedy and many others, a delusion still pursued in Afghanistan and Iraq. But he was also negotiating with the North Vietnamese and above all had ended military conscription, thereby ending mass demonstrations. For the millions who had supported the war and tired of it, or who no longer were faced with conscription, it seemed that "he's working on it and it's almost over. Give him a chance."
    Einstein on marxology:
    "In the realm of the seekers after truth there is no human authority.
    Whoever attempts to play the magistrate there founders on the laughter of the Gods."

  2. #342
    Paperback Writer RevForum Administrator Amoeba's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Posts
    7,231

    Default Re: Questions for CJ

    There is one union, the GMB, which has been fighting Corbyn, partly I believe because he's opposed to Trident and they want to protect the workers who are reliant on that, but the main UNITE union is firmly behind Corbyn, and Len McCluskey recently was reelected as its head. To refreshen your memory, he's this guy:

    To be, or not to be, that is the question: Whether 'tis nobler in the mind to suffer,
    Or to take arms against a sea of troubles, And by opposing end them.

  3. #343
    Administrator RevForum Administrator CornetJoyce's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    3,863

    Default Re: Questions for CJ

    An excellent performance. In response to repeated "alternative reality" declamations, he repeats his rebuttal as often as required and comes out way ahead.
    Einstein on marxology:
    "In the realm of the seekers after truth there is no human authority.
    Whoever attempts to play the magistrate there founders on the laughter of the Gods."

  4. #344
    Paperback Writer RevForum Administrator Amoeba's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Posts
    7,231

    Default Re: Questions for CJ

    Do you know Mary Antin? And have you read her The Promised Land?

    If not I highly recommend it. It's a great book. You can read it here.

    Also do you know Randolph Bourne? Any thoughts on his writings, particularly his "Trans-National America"?
    To be, or not to be, that is the question: Whether 'tis nobler in the mind to suffer,
    Or to take arms against a sea of troubles, And by opposing end them.

  5. #345
    Administrator RevForum Administrator CornetJoyce's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    3,863

    Default Re: Questions for CJ

    Quote Originally Posted by Amoeba View Post
    Do you know Mary Antin? And have you read her The Promised Land?
    If not I highly recommend it. It's a great book. You can read it here.
    Thanks for the link. I knew of her but hadn't read her. I agree: great book. I think my wife knows it.
    There's a certain irony in Bourne's praise of her: she was an avid supporter of T. Roosevelt, the most bellicose denouncer of "hyphenated Americans." I think the other great progressive W. Wilson was second.

    Quote Originally Posted by Amoeba View Post
    Also do you know Randolph Bourne? Any thoughts on his writings, particularly his "Trans-National America"?
    Bourne has long been an icon for peaceniks, and rightfully so, but he wasn't alone. I think 50 some congressmen voted against Wilson's war. His complaint about Anglomania was shared and exceeded by Mencken, whose "strident" tone he criticized.

    Bourne says
    Our American ideal can make no progress until we do away with this romantic gilding of the past. All our idealisms must be those of future social goals
    .... No mere doubtful triumphs of the past


    I leave the romantic gilding of the future and its undoubted triumphs to the idealists of hollywood and silicon valley.
    Einstein on marxology:
    "In the realm of the seekers after truth there is no human authority.
    Whoever attempts to play the magistrate there founders on the laughter of the Gods."

  6. #346
    Paperback Writer RevForum Administrator Amoeba's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Posts
    7,231

    Default Re: Questions for CJ

    Yeah, I read the Antin book almost a decade ago and I'm still sometimes reminded of parts of it. It has the same kind of "feel" to me as some of Gorky's stuff. She's a great writer and storyteller, and of course she had a great story to tell in that book.

    Bourne is an excellent writer too, and his thinking can reach some pretty decent heights as well at times, particularly in that "Trans-National America" piece.

    I haven't read much of Mencken but it's on my to-read list - alongside countless others though, so not sure when I'll be able to get to it.
    To be, or not to be, that is the question: Whether 'tis nobler in the mind to suffer,
    Or to take arms against a sea of troubles, And by opposing end them.

  7. #347
    Administrator RevForum Administrator CornetJoyce's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    3,863

    Default Re: Questions for CJ

    Quote Originally Posted by Amoeba View Post
    Bourne is an excellent writer too, and his thinking can reach some pretty decent heights as well at times, particularly in that "Trans-National America" piece.

    I haven't read much of Mencken but it's on my to-read list - alongside countless others though, so not sure when I'll be able to get to it.
    Bourne's distaste for dixie was of course shared by Mencken and, a year or so after Bourne's TNA, Mencken published his Sahara of the Bozart which prompted a Southern literary movement.
    Einstein on marxology:
    "In the realm of the seekers after truth there is no human authority.
    Whoever attempts to play the magistrate there founders on the laughter of the Gods."

  8. #348
    Paperback Writer RevForum Administrator Amoeba's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Posts
    7,231

    Default Re: Questions for CJ

    What do you think of the leaked Labour manifesto so far?
    To be, or not to be, that is the question: Whether 'tis nobler in the mind to suffer,
    Or to take arms against a sea of troubles, And by opposing end them.

  9. #349
    Administrator RevForum Administrator CornetJoyce's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    3,863

    Default Re: Questions for CJ

    I'm a little puzzled by the term "leaked manifesto." Is that related to a silent noise, or a basement roof? But it's their election; I guess they know how it's done. It looks like a through liberal program, even the revival of postal banks, which was also one of Sanders' items.

    Apparently, it lacks a transportation section, although some transportation matters are addressed elsewhere. In my view, public transport should mean fareless rides. The NYC transport union still included that in its wish list not long ago and maybe still does.

    An economic slump could erase those higher taxes on the rich. I think the Left in power should as a matter of course give a high priority to the creation or strengthening of worker and community based institutions.
    Einstein on marxology:
    "In the realm of the seekers after truth there is no human authority.
    Whoever attempts to play the magistrate there founders on the laughter of the Gods."

  10. #350
    Paperback Writer RevForum Administrator Amoeba's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Posts
    7,231

    Default Re: Questions for CJ

    I am not sure what you mean regarding the manifesto being leaked? It's referred to as that because someone inside the Party leaked it to the press before it was supposed to be officially announced, which happens to be today. There are many theories floating around about who leaked it and why, with some suggesting it was a pro-Corbyn person to make sure it wouldn't be changed very much the next day at a final meeting to vote on it, while others suggest it was done by right-wingers as a continuing act of sabotage. I believe it was probably the latter and it backfired, as so many of these right-wing schemes have been doing since Corbyn got elected leader.

    I'm looking forward to reading the final version published today, and hope it'll be along the same lines of the stuff that we already know about. Probably the most significant elements for me are the higher taxes on top incomes and corporations, the setting up of an investment bank, building 100.000 council houses a year, and abolishing tuition fees.
    To be, or not to be, that is the question: Whether 'tis nobler in the mind to suffer,
    Or to take arms against a sea of troubles, And by opposing end them.

  11. #351
    Administrator RevForum Administrator CornetJoyce's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    3,863

    Default Re: Questions for CJ

    Quote Originally Posted by Amoeba View Post
    I am not sure what you mean regarding the manifesto being leaked? It's referred to as that because someone inside the Party leaked it to the press before it was supposed to be officially announced, which happens to be today
    Secrets are "leaked" and a manifesto is the opposite of a secret.
    If
    Quote Originally Posted by Amoeba View Post
    it was a pro-Corbyn person to make sure it wouldn't be changed very much the next day at a final meeting to vote on it
    then I hope it worked. (I haven't checked the news yet.)


    Quote Originally Posted by Amoeba View Post
    others suggest it was done by right-wingers as a continuing act of sabotage. I believe it was probably the latter and it backfired, as so many of these right-wing schemes have been doing since Corbyn got elected leader.
    in which case, let us praise the gods for giving us imbeciles for enemies.
    Einstein on marxology:
    "In the realm of the seekers after truth there is no human authority.
    Whoever attempts to play the magistrate there founders on the laughter of the Gods."

  12. #352
    Paperback Writer RevForum Administrator Amoeba's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Posts
    7,231

    Default Re: Questions for CJ

    Quote Originally Posted by CornetJoyce View Post
    in which case, let us praise the gods for giving us imbeciles for enemies.
    haha amen to that.

    It's particularly funny because Blairites have created this image of themselves as experts at political machinations but it turns out they're nothing but bumbling, clueless morons.

    Also, you can read the published manifesto here: http://www.labour.org.uk/page/-/Imag...sto%202017.pdf

    If you can get around to it would love to know your thoughts, particularly on the constitutional convention.
    To be, or not to be, that is the question: Whether 'tis nobler in the mind to suffer,
    Or to take arms against a sea of troubles, And by opposing end them.

  13. #353
    Administrator RevForum Administrator CornetJoyce's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    3,863

    Default Re: Questions for CJ

    As advertised, it's a platform Shelley Himself could support.

    There's no indication that a convention would construct a paper constitution, which the brits have done well without. A convention might help in moving toward devolution, but the lords have already been reduced to a vestige of bygone glory without a convention or a paper constitution.
    Einstein on marxology:
    "In the realm of the seekers after truth there is no human authority.
    Whoever attempts to play the magistrate there founders on the laughter of the Gods."

  14. #354
    Paperback Writer RevForum Administrator Amoeba's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Posts
    7,231

    Default Re: Questions for CJ

    Shakespeare or Goethe? Tolstoy or Flaubert?
    To be, or not to be, that is the question: Whether 'tis nobler in the mind to suffer,
    Or to take arms against a sea of troubles, And by opposing end them.

  15. #355
    Administrator RevForum Administrator CornetJoyce's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    3,863

    Default Re: Questions for CJ

    There's nothing from Flaubert, of course, that compares to War and Peace, and I've never been drawn to either Karenina or Bovary. I think the most ambitious reading of Flaubert I've done was his correspondence with George Sand.

    I suppose Shakespeare flies at too high an altitude even for Goethe
    Einstein on marxology:
    "In the realm of the seekers after truth there is no human authority.
    Whoever attempts to play the magistrate there founders on the laughter of the Gods."

  16. #356
    Paperback Writer RevForum Administrator Amoeba's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Posts
    7,231

    Default Re: Questions for CJ

    What are your thoughts on Kant, including his moral and political philosophy and his work in what in modern terms can be called philosophy of science?

    Also, regarding the Kantian, deontological moral system, do you find it more persuasive than the utilitarian account? By that I mean not necessarily in terms of arguments, but also as an attractive ideal to live up to?

    My own feelings about Kant is that while I find many of his arguments interesting and in some cases compelling, what draws me to his writings is more the aesthetics of it. I have the same with Marx and in fact all other writers I like in the realm of philosophy, sociology, anthropology, history, whatever. Mill and Bentham can't write, and I feel their incompetence as writers has laid the foundation for horrible writing in the whole 'analytic' tradition of philosophy, where 'logical arguments' take center stage even though they are fundamentally aesthetic in kind too, just appealing to a different (much smaller) audience: other analytic philosophers.

    The best of them, people like Rawls (who incidentally was inspired by Kant), fortunately have managed to uphold a higher aesthetic in their writing.

    I don't know, I just feel like the aesthetic of a text is a much more powerful element of its attractiveness than the purely epistemic content it contains, if it is at all possible to separate the epistemic from the aesthetic or normative. Marx's influence as a writer had a lot more to do with his aesthetic sensibilities than with his knowledge of political economy, I believe.

    Any thoughts on that?
    To be, or not to be, that is the question: Whether 'tis nobler in the mind to suffer,
    Or to take arms against a sea of troubles, And by opposing end them.

  17. #357
    Administrator RevForum Administrator CornetJoyce's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    3,863

    Default Re: Questions for CJ

    Had I been on the market for moral philosophy, Kant might have been on my shopping list; what I recall of it seemed to me "sensible." I do indeed find Kant more persuasive than Bentham, but neither offers much of an ideal to live up to. Such an ideal seems to me more likely to be an exemplar rather than a system or argument.

    I suppose the aspect of Kant I found most instructive was his understanding of the Mind and the World Outside the Mind. Discussions on the forum often bring that to mind.

    Kant avoided a doctrine of natural right in Property, but his politics were fairly conventional.


    Quote Originally Posted by Amoeba View Post
    My own feelings about Kant is that while I find many of his arguments interesting and in some cases compelling, what draws me to his writings is more the aesthetics of it. I have the same with Marx and in fact all other writers I like in the realm of philosophy, sociology, anthropology, history, whatever. Mill and Bentham can't write, and I feel their incompetence as writers has laid the foundation for horrible writing in the whole 'analytic' tradition of philosophy, where 'logical arguments' take center stage even though they are fundamentally aesthetic in kind too, just appealing to a different (much smaller) audience: other analytic philosophers.

    The best of them, people like Rawls (who incidentally was inspired by Kant), fortunately have managed to uphold a higher aesthetic in their writing.

    I don't know, I just feel like the aesthetic of a text is a much more powerful element of its attractiveness than the purely epistemic content it contains, if it is at all possible to separate the epistemic from the aesthetic or normative. Marx's influence as a writer had a lot more to do with his aesthetic sensibilities than with his knowledge of political economy, I believe.

    Any thoughts on that?
    While I demur to Marx's "theoretical" nostrums, I admire and enjoy his punditry.

    The journal Telos was not known for its accessibility, but they advised contributors to read Twain on Cooper's Prose Style.
    http://twain.lib.virginia.edu/projec...o/offense.html
    http://strangebeautiful.com/other-te...rose-style.pdf
    and then there was Wright Mills' notorious "translation" of Talcott Parsons' 555 page book of grand obscurantist prose into 4 legible paragraphs.
    Einstein on marxology:
    "In the realm of the seekers after truth there is no human authority.
    Whoever attempts to play the magistrate there founders on the laughter of the Gods."

  18. #358
    Administrator RevForum Administrator CornetJoyce's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    3,863

    Default Re: Questions for CJ

    speaking of Bourne:

    Randolph Bourne
    came as an inhabitant of this earth
    without the pleasure of choosing his dwelling or his career.
    He was a hunchback, grandson of a congregational minister, born in 1886 in Bloomfield, New Jersey; there he attended grammarschool and highschool.
    At the age of seventeen he went to work as a secretary to a Morristown businessman.
    He worked his way through Columbia working in a pianola record factory in Newark, working as proofreader, pianotuner, accompanist in a vocal studio in Carnegie Hall.
    At Columbia he studied with John Dewey,
    got a traveling fellowship that took him to England Paris Rome Berlin Copenhagen,
    wrote a book on the Gary schools.
    In Europe he heard music, a great deal of Wagner and Scriabine
    and bought himself a black cape.

    This little sparrowlike man,
    tiny twisted bit of flesh in a black cape,
    always in pain and ailing,
    put a pebble in his sling
    and hit Goliath square in the forehead with it.
    War, he wrote, is the health of the state.

    Half musician, half educational theorist (weak health and being poor and twisted in body and on bad terms with his people hadn’t spoiled the world for Randolph Bourne; he was a happy man, loved die Meistersinger and playing Bach with his long hands that stretched so easily over the keys and pretty girls and good food and evenings of talk. When he was dying of pneumonia a friend brought him an eggnog; Look at the yellow, its beautiful, he kept saying as his life ebbed into delirium and fever. He was a happy man.) Bourne seized with feverish intensity on the ideas then going around at Columbia he picked rosy glasses out of the turgid jumble of John Dewey’s teaching through which he saw clear and sharp
    the shining capitol of reformed democracy,
    Wilson’s New Freedom;
    but he was too good a mathematician; he had to work the equations out;
    with the result
    that in the crazy spring of 1917 he began to get unpopular where his bread was buttered at the New Republic;
    for New Freedom read Conscription, for Democracy, Win the War, for Reform, Safeguard the Morgan Loans
    for Progress Civilization Education Service,
    Buy a Liberty Bond,
    Strafe the Hun,
    Jail the Objectors.
    He resigned from the New Republic; only The Seven Arts had the nerve to publish his articles against the war. The backers of the Seven Arts took their money elsewhere; friends didn’t like to be seen with Bourne, his father wrote him begging him not to disgrace the family name. The rainbowtinted future of reformed democracy went pop like a pricked soapbubble.
    The liberals scurried to Washington;
    some of his friends pled with him to climb up on Schoolmaster Wilson’s sharabang; the war was great fought from the swivel chairs of Mr. Creel’s bureau in Washington.
    He was cartooned, shadowed by the espionage service and the counter-espionage service; taking a walk with two girl friends at Wood’s Hole he was arrested, a trunk full of manuscript and letters stolen from him in Connecticut. (Force to the utmost, thundered Schoolmaster Wilson)
    He didn’t live to see the big circus of the Peace of Versailles or the purplish normalcy of the Ohio Gang. Six weeks after the armistice he died planning an essay on the foundations of future radicalism in America.

    If any man has a ghost
    Bourne has a ghost,
    a tiny twisted unscared ghost in a black cloak
    hopping along the grimy old brick and brownstone streets still left in downtown New York,
    crying out in a shrill soundless giggle;
    War is the health of the state.

    -- Dos Passos
    Einstein on marxology:
    "In the realm of the seekers after truth there is no human authority.
    Whoever attempts to play the magistrate there founders on the laughter of the Gods."

  19. #359
    Paperback Writer RevForum Administrator Amoeba's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Posts
    7,231

    Default Re: Questions for CJ

    Thanks for that. Great eulogy.

    Should read his America trilogy some day.
    To be, or not to be, that is the question: Whether 'tis nobler in the mind to suffer,
    Or to take arms against a sea of troubles, And by opposing end them.

  20. #360
    Paperback Writer RevForum Administrator Amoeba's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Posts
    7,231

    Default Re: Questions for CJ

    What do you think of the American transcendentalists? Thoreau and Emerson?
    To be, or not to be, that is the question: Whether 'tis nobler in the mind to suffer,
    Or to take arms against a sea of troubles, And by opposing end them.

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may edit your posts
  •